View Full Version : Telkom ADSL inquiry discussion
|sAvAgE|
13 Apr 2005, 17:52
Part 1: Telkom ADSL ‘not for bandwidth hogs'
“Telkom's ADSL service was never intended for bandwidth-hungry applications, such as gaming or online trading,” according to the submission, which also includes peer-to-peer networks among the “abusers” of the technology.
“Such applications use large bandwidth, hence affects the bandwidth that is available for usage by other customers. The 3GB cap has been introduced to ensure heavy bandwidth users do not adversely affect ADSL users.”
full article: http://www.itweb.co.za/sections/telecoms/2005/0504131137.asp?S=Internet&A=INT&O=FRGN
this bit here:
Roberts added that an independent survey by Markinor showed that 84% of residential users said Telkom ADSL met their expectations, while the figure for business users was 87%.
shows just how uninformed people are :(
------------------------
Part 2: Telkom ADSL ‘ripping us off' (15/04)
Telkom announced yesterday that its ADSL service was significantly improved, adding that a survey showed 88% of its users were happy with it, but Muller says this seems unlikely. “I for one was never contacted for that survey, who were the people queried?”
Muller then cited an independent poll on the Internet, which asked whether ADSL customers were satisfied with the service. Of the 721 votes, 83% said no.
“We also surveyed people on whether they thought the pricing model was acceptable, to which over 90% of respondents said no.”
He then accused Telkom of providing misinformation regarding the implementation of a ‘cap' at yesterday's meeting. “They allege that it is the Internet service providers that are the one's enforcing it, when in fact it is they who choose whether or not to do so.”
full article: http://www.itweb.co.za/sections/telecoms/2005/0504151152.asp
<A>BioGizzard
13 Apr 2005, 17:55
Bull*cough*shit*cough*
Summed it up quite nicely, Bio ;)
Where did they get those figures from that so many ppl were happy. Telkoms surveys?
one of the famou telkom survey
telkom rep: hi, this is telkom rep, are u mr x
x: yes
tr: we are doing a survey on our services and we need to know if u qulify to take part
x: yes
tr: do u have any complaints about our service?
x: yes
tr sorry u don't qualify for the survey, thanks bye
187<>Ceasar~
14 Apr 2005, 09:59
HAHA- n1 Weed
Cataphract
14 Apr 2005, 12:45
That gaming uses a lot of bandwith is utter bloody tripe. I can game all night long everyday of the week and I'll never get to my 3GB cap.
The only reason they threw that into the pot is to have the excuse that "it was never intended for gaming" when a gamer complains. Gaming simply exposes problems much quicker and is more sensitive to crappy lines, so, hence the convenience of the excuse.
*sigh* I think a rampage with a Shotgun at the TELKOM head office will be the only serious solution.
MaXimus
14 Apr 2005, 13:18
This Telkom bullshit %$%&^*&* pisses me off!
Cataphract
14 Apr 2005, 13:20
Where have you ever heard of people selling broadband, that is not supposed to be used like broadband?
Shall we make cars and say "buy our cars, they cost more than any other car in the world, and oh, by the way, they're actually not supposed to be driven at anything faster than the speed you can walk at, oh, wait, and there's also a limit of 800 meters a day, which is more than enough transport for anyone."
i'm behind sneaky in a Goliath (or even a leviathan), shotgun wont do enuff dmg, even tho it will feel good to shove some lead into them by hand.
I recall hellboy making a post when he was being checked to see if he qualified to be part of the survey. and since he had direct access to media he was disqualified.
MaXimus
14 Apr 2005, 13:28
So what is ADSL supposed to be used for? Just Email? Soon they are going to tell us that ADSL was never intended for browsing websites with images in them. Perhaps we should tell them that ADSL is not exactly like BELTEL.
Hey did you guys hear that petrol went up?
MaXimus
14 Apr 2005, 13:34
OMG!!!! Nooo! :O
Yeah serious. Hectic hey?
I guess you guys will just have to drive less so you can still afford dsl.
Dominate
14 Apr 2005, 13:44
Where have you ever heard of people selling broadband, that is not supposed to be used like broadband?
Shall we make cars and say "buy our cars, they cost more than any other car in the world, and oh, by the way, they're actually not supposed to be driven at anything faster than the speed you can walk at, oh, wait, and there's also a limit of 800 meters a day, which is more than enough transport for anyone."
Very well put, i also agree that if broadband wasnt intended on broadband useage, what the hell was it intended for? this inquest is gonna solve nothing, other than allowing telkom to keep there high prices and have ICASA behund them
8 Bucks a litre pretty soon...
*sigh* I think a rampage with a Shotgun at the EXXON head office will be the only serious solution.
A lot more usefull than doing it at Telkom.
ye, i said, telkom will just bullshit their way out of the inquest, and claim ignorance when cornered, that way there will be no solution.
and ye, hectic petrol hike, over R5 now, and i drive 80km to work, thank goodness i'm moving closer to work now.
Cataphract
14 Apr 2005, 14:02
Scrye, what are you doing here? You should be training man!!!!
MaXimus
14 Apr 2005, 14:08
LOL :D
MaXimus
14 Apr 2005, 14:14
Since petrol is so expensive I think I'm going to get a motorcycle. I think this new 1500cc Suzuki will do just fine.
Where have you ever heard of people selling broadband, that is not supposed to be used like broadband?
no, the problem is that people have a belief that just because they have broad band - they have to max out their connection 24/7.
Use it, enjoy the speeds and keep quiet about the fact that they dont like you downloading gigs of illegal movies and pirated software.
<A>Nom@n
14 Apr 2005, 15:20
*shrug*
well i for one have a problem with paying more than a small car's repayment for a service i can only use at rated capacity for 9.5 hours a month before being restricted.
MaXimus
14 Apr 2005, 15:28
Hehehe, so this has come back full circle again. I'm shaking my head in disbelieve at Telkom's supposed ignorance stating things like games use lot's of bandwidth. It's definitely not the games I play which takes up most of my bandwidth. Oh shit, we are not allowed to complain or state our views on UnrealZA, I completely forgot! :P
Cataphract
14 Apr 2005, 15:36
I also don't want the service ruined for everybody by a couple of people who won't fork out R180,00 for a DVD and I believe a reasonable cap is a good idea. But at the price w're paying we should have 1mb lines and bigger caps.
enemyanemone
14 Apr 2005, 16:46
That gaming uses a lot of bandwith is utter bloody tripe. I can game all night long everyday of the week and I'll never get to my 3GB cap.
hmm if all night = 5 hours a night @ aprox. 20 mb traffic per hour then you could reach it. That doesnt justify telkoms excuse thou that the service was not developed for gaming. I guess we should all put down ut´s netspeed and save traffic :P
But at the price w're paying we should have 1mb lines and bigger caps.
At the price most of you are paying you could have two gigabit ports at LoNAP. The argument was the cap though - I dont agree that home users should expect downloading over 50GB a month is reasonable.
Maximus, am I not allowed to post MY view then?
Karnaugh has a valid point. I do belief in capping otherwise ADSL will look like MyWireless pretty soon, and NO SA is not the only country that has 3Gig caps. Its the price the cap comes with thats ridiculous. I also feel that the they should be selling capping options and bandwith options as 512 is really entry level as far as DSL is concerned.
Another option I think they should use is Package accounts, you buy a 3gig account and every meg over that is charged per Meg with no cap.
Telkom should not play ISP and enforce the 3Gb cap on every ISP. It should really be left to the ISP themselves and no, stringing 2 or 3 account togheter to give a bigger cap is not choice!
I do not download any MP3's, videos, games etc. so my 3Gig is allright, but it is still way too little. Game downloads for one comes in at 300-700 meg nowadays, and I am too damn scared to touch it nowadays. I'd rather request NAG to put it on their DVD, but that is realy not the purpose of ADSL. I would say a 10Gb cap would be more than fair for now, giving power users enough bandwidth to get all they want (yes even those Linux distros ever pirate claim they download :P), but will still be little enough to curb P2P.
Just my 2c of course...
Cataphract
15 Apr 2005, 09:18
I dont agree that home users should expect downloading over 50GB a month is reasonable.
I fully agree with that.
As I understand it, however, Icasa scheduled the hearings principally over the pricing issue. The cap is relevant in so far as it indicates that what we get is not worth what we're paying for, I think. I'm not 100% sure about exactly how far Icasa's legal jurisdiction stretches, but they should logically have wide powers in relation to all things communications related.
Cat, unfortunately ICASA is just the government's puppet. I'll be very surprised if these hearings brings anything positive before the SNO appears.
The thing is Cataphract is that we (the IT related people, that I know and talk to at least) do not want ICASA to restrain Telkom's prices - we want them to open the market and allow us to compete fairly
Cataphract
15 Apr 2005, 09:40
I agree. Genuine competition is surely better than artificial price control. For starters artificial price control does not exactly inspire good service, like competition does.
MaXimus
15 Apr 2005, 10:02
The problem is whether the competition is going to actually provide competition. For example, a third cellphone provider helped nothing, nadda, fokkollo with regards to pricing.
I dunno Maximus, vodacom has dropped prices on gprs, to undercut the other 2, but the biggest problem with the third cell provider was/is the fact that cell c is running on vodacoms network.
On a side note. didn't even notice petrol jumped so much, lately I've been mainly using my ferrari instead of the Toyota. Guess I'm gonna have to use the toyota even less now, which will mean... hmmm.... I need to start it sometimes to stop the battry from going flat.
The problem is whether the competition is going to actually provide competition. For example, a third cellphone provider helped nothing, nadda, fokkollo with regards to pricing.
I'm not talking about an SNO. or a TNO, or a FNO.
I'm talking about a 9999999999999999999999th NO. We need an *open* market, ungoverned by licence restrictions (asside from frequency band)
I would most certainly provide competition if it didnt mean I'd go to jail.
Boogeyman
15 Apr 2005, 14:28
http://www.itweb.co.za/sections/telecoms/2005/0504151152.asp?O=SLF
well, i had a perfect example of telkom service 2day:
i'm moving so i want to move my ADSL with me:
so i thinkg the logical thing is to place an order for it at the new address about 3 weeks b4 i move.
phonecall 1 - 10219, telkom new services (who else, this is quite a logical number to call)
i get my identity accross, and she tries to sell me 3 other services in the process (2 not related to data at all), and get put on hold 2 times, then...
get told to call 0800375375 (adsl help desk)
get told that i must get a "outside transfer", and call
0800375800, but also get told that doing that will cause me problems, so its better i do a cancelation of my current 1 and a new application (by the same guy that said "outside transfer"):smack:
i call 0800375800,
i explain what i want,
i explain it again....
i get put on hold... 2 minutes:banghead:
i explain it again
get put on hold...... 2 minutes:banghead:
HANG UP
(this is the short version)
that is why we pay so much, so they can employ 50 ppl to man phone lines that send you between them, and their supervisors
Miller time!:drunk:
MaXimus
15 Apr 2005, 15:32
Screw work, I'll join you just now.
U should've seen the fun and games I had trying to get adsl. My company is sponsoring it for me, so it was in a company name and it was home adsl. It took them a while to get that right.
Cataphract
15 Apr 2005, 16:54
I also feel burnt by the fact that the cap is calculated on international AND local traffic. If it's our international bandwith that's a scarcity, why penalise us equally for using local bandwith? A cap is a must but at least only cap international traffic.
|sAvAgE|
15 Apr 2005, 17:37
just made some changes to the 1st post i made. perhaps we can use this thread to discuss the whole inquiry instead of starting different threads each time a new article/news piece is released.
seems i cant change the topic though, could an admin/mod do it? perhaps to "Telkom ADSL inquiry discussion" or something
I also feel burnt by the fact that the cap is calculated on international AND local traffic. If it's our international bandwith that's a scarcity, why penalise us equally for using local bandwith? A cap is a must but at least only cap international traffic.
I agree or at least make everything running thru SAIX servers free i.e. downloads and games.
I also feel burnt by the fact that the cap is calculated on international AND local traffic. If it's our international bandwith that's a scarcity, why penalise us equally for using local bandwith? A cap is a must but at least only cap international traffic.
Wow, Telkom's marketing really fooled you didnt they :)
Seriously, our international bandwidth is not a scarcity - Telkom have a good 150Gbps at their disposal - easily increased too. However they keep the extra fibre dark to control demand, and only alocate under 1Gbps to SAIX.
If they were to open the SAT-3 at full capacity they could easily carry over 300,000 ADSL subscribers at full rate. And thats neglecting the other pipes we have to the East.
not that I'm negating ur statement, but where did u get these stats?
Those figures are my own that are based on what I have learnt from these sources, among others.
http://www.ee.und.ac.za/school/RATS/coverpage.asp
http://www.safe-sat3.co.za/SystemInformation/SystemInformation.asp
http://www.saix.net/diagrams/saix.pdf
http://www.ispa.org.za/
http://www.internet.org.za/
(These links may not contain the information that you're after, alot of which was communicated verbaly or by email)
thx man, i can see it all there...
depressing actually, how we allow this continue!
Im am sooooooo sick and tired of telkom. Its as if they derive pleasure from pissing us off. If they have a grain of salt between their ears its a celebration.
Reading these comments one realises we can complain all we want, ICASA can do all they want and SNO can take as long as they want but things will never change :(
]H[ellboy
17 Apr 2005, 10:10
Guys I did a presentation on Thursday, last week for the ICASA hearings. I had to submit evidence regarding Telkom and their service.... The Irony is as I was giving my presentation regarding the repeated failure of Telkom to correct a problem on Gunny's line a Telkom Van drove into him!
It was an act of Telkom.
Punishment for not sacraficing a virgin before them.
<A>FluX.v2.0
17 Apr 2005, 11:12
Rofl
All bow down to the evil telkom gods.
RPM's (owner of MyADSL and instigator of the ICASA hearing) speech
http://home.telkomsa.net/rudolph/ICASA.ppt (http://home.telkomsa.net/rudolph/ICASA.ppt)
Interesting read, but will it amount to anything?
I would like to state that I disagree with Rudolph's "solutions"
While the statements in the presentation may be true, I fear that the tunnel vision approach of "Force Telkom to lower prices" will be damaging to the market which should be opened to competition (This is not impossible, they just have to DO IT). All end "web users" see is the price they are paying and this cannot be addressed naively.
Maintenance (labour) of the DSLAM equipment is also not taken into account in the arguments - something Telkom will most likely use as defence.
Karnaugh, although I agree with you mostly, I do think that Rudolph's and other speeches, actually opens the eyes of Icasa, users and potential users. To see those graphs in perspective against international sollutions, is just plain worrysome.
I also agree that just dropping line rental is not the sollution, and I was actually quite dissapointed to see him hammering on it, but it did bring a point across - Telkom are uniquely ripping us off!
I listened to a 702 interview they had with ICASA , some IS fundi and Rudolph, and the IS guy actually raised an interesting stat.
Roughly quoted he said that a dedicated 2mbit/s link between JHB and CPT cost the same as a 45Mbit/s link between New York and UK! That is just damn sad!
dont forget the cost of the call centre, and its supervisors.
Sad stats?
How about this
http://www.lonap.net/
The costs for connecting to LoNAP are GBP500 +VAT joining fee (which
includes Cat5e FTP cabling to your rack in Telehouse / Redbus HX, and
GBP2000 +VAT per year, which includes two ports, running at 100Mbps
or Gigabit.
http://www.linx.net/joining/fee-sched.thtml
100Mb Port Availability Charge monthly GBP 175
1Gb Port Availability Charge monthly GBP 644
- Availability Charge on 2nd Gb port (discounted by 25%) monthly GBP 483
10Gb Port Availability Charge (when available) monthly GBP 2,415
dont forget the cost of the call centre, and its supervisors.
I'm sure those dont cost that much... I think they get the ones that didnt qualify to work at KFC.
Dont forget they will still be making theyre profit even after they have stopped ripping us off.
Getting them to drop connectione fees is a start, baby steps. You just cant walse in of the street and expect to turn the country's entire telcomunications industry on its head.
Another thing that migt be worth doing is to get the financial sector involved to show the negative impact TELKOM's current practices are having on economic growth. That might even get political party's involved and increase pressure on TELKOM.
Cataphract
17 Apr 2005, 15:10
I think they get the ones that didnt qualify to work at KFC.
Yes, the ones who were too undergrade to become deep fried chicken.
Man u know what, if we were capped, telkom should atleast give us 64k international bandwidth, that way we can still browse, i dont mind the cap that much, coz i download most of my stuff locally anywayz, but fpr when i want to upgrade my graphics drivers etc.
Little off da topic of the endless moaning n bitching over telkom...
Just saw 10gigs for R400 and 20gigs for R500 at www.axxess.co.za (http://www.axxess.co.za)
no contract
looks nice. any guinea pigs???? cat ur filthy rich..... :)
he is aldready guineapigging for AYCE
Cataphract
19 Apr 2005, 09:58
cat ur filthy rich..... :)
Naaaah, just filthy! :D
If you want to know how allyoucaneat is going, it's going absolutely great. I can see no difference whatsoever between my AYCE account and my MWeb account, as far as speed and reliability is concerned. 100% all the way. So far so good :D
Cataphract
20 Apr 2005, 09:33
From today's Business Day
The hearings will end today with Telkom given a final chance to defend itself. But the operator believes it is not being given a fair hearing by the Icasa panel, chaired by councillor Mamodupi Mohlala.
“We don’t believe we are getting a fair hearing because of a lack of neutrality on behalf of the chairwoman,” said Telkom spokesman Xolisa Vapi. “It would appear that the hearings have a pre-determined outcome…. The chairwoman is taking an aggressive line towards Telkom. We welcome robust discussion, but it must be fair.”
Vapi also said that private correspondence sent by Telkom to Icasa had been published on the MyADSL website just an hour after it was sent.
Interesting how none of their responses relate to a possible justification for the high charges, the low speed, or the low cap.
The article also quotes some interesting statistics. It is available here:
Business (http://www.businessday.co.za/articles/economy.aspx?ID=BD4A37230)
*Sigh* Still waiting for my ADSL, it is strectching to 3 & a half month already... ( I don't think I can wait any longer :/)
Leg swak dude. I ordered after you and got it before you. However I have a ping of 300 to whatever I do localy. So I can't play UT. Upside to all this I am back online and I can play WOW. Just hang in there. I just hope Telkom sort out my line soon. Going onto 5 months now, no UT. :(
Let's face is gents, Telkom will much rather drag Icasa to court than lower their prices. Unless by some miraculous reason Icasa convince ole Ivy to change some laws (and undermine the government's fat cut of the Telkom shares), Telkom will lower the prices if and when they deem fit.
It was great we got this large consumer reaction, but what will it help? I wonder...
Cataphract
20 Apr 2005, 12:59
I agree with Gamos. The comments made by Telkom indicate one thing and one thing only - they will take Icasa on review to the High Court if a decision is made that doesn't suit them. Besides, it makes commercial sense. Courts are risky for both parties, and when this much money is at stake, Telkom has nothing to lose by litigating.
Yep Well I suppose this moves to my 4 year with no UT :/ Just some online play now & then (TP LANS :D)
I agree with Gamos. The comments made by Telkom indicate one thing and one thing only - they will take Icasa on review to the High Court if a decision is made that doesn't suit them. Besides, it makes commercial sense. Courts are risky for both parties, and when this much money is at stake, Telkom has nothing to lose by litigating.
I guess it could only be more obvious that deregulation and open competition is the only true solution (http://www.karnaugh.za.net/show?id=90) to this problem, unless it fucking jumped up and kicked you in the head.
Very impressive and well written there Karnaugh (is that your work?), but thinking about the whole ICASA hearing, it was about ADSL only.
They could hardly argue price of bandwidth, the hold on SAT3, the lack of competition etc., since it was only about the pricing and cap of ADSL. RPM's presentation for one hammered on destroying the rental cost - some naive stupidity as you put it, but what better could he argue?
It was really a hearing about the leather used on rugby balls, when the politics behind rugby is the real problem to us losing so many games.
If Icasa is worth anything, they will take the ADSL hearing as a corner stone to make suggestions to the minister, that they should indeed open the market even further, not just add VOIP and claim us deregulated.
I think a maximum charge could be a good idea declaring bandwidth a crucial service (like petrol and electricity), but I only think this is fair if its met with competition.
Telkom them SELVES said at the ICASA hearing that the ADSL price would drop if there were competition, and I think thats a powerfull enough sign that the real problem here is that government sitting on their hands and talking too much, and doing nothing.
Yes, like everything on my site, it is my work.
FRESH research into the cost of telecommunications services has confirmed that Telkom’s fees are far above international norms and are depressing SA’s economic growth.
Telkom’s fees are up to 400% dearer than identical services in other countries — a burden on the economy that is “holding SA back”, said Stephan Malherbe, a director of Genesis Analytics.
The research was commissioned by the South Africa Foundation, which represents about 15 major multinationals trading in SA and the top 50 JSE Securities Exchange SA-listed companies.
“This is not a crude bit of Telkom-bashing,” said the foundation’s executive director, Michael Spicer. “This is a key area in society’s competitiveness and ability to grow, and clearly we haven’t got it right.”
The findings would support the foundation’s calls for policy changes to create an environment conducive to economic growth and job creation, he said.
The most urgent calls will be for the introduction of price caps on international bandwidth and to force Telkom to offer wholesale packages so internet service providers (ISPs) can lower their own fees to end users.
Telkom’s most extreme fees are slapped on its international leased lines: they are 400% dearer than the average price from 14 comparable countries and three times dearer than the next most expensive country.
Those lines are used by ISPs, by multinationals to link to branches in different countries, and by call centre operators, with the high fees preventing them from being globally competitive.
Telkom admits its fees are high compared with some operators.
“We are cognisant of the need to lower our tariffs for both data and voice services, and continue to do so,” said media relations specialist Xolisa Vapi. Telkom’s tariffs were cost-based and had to cover wages and equipment, but further cuts were coming, he said.
However, Genesis Analytics argues that Telkom’s fees are not justified by its running costs
Today 21/04/05
187<>Ceasar~
21 Apr 2005, 17:25
"However, Genesis Analytics argues that Telkom’s fees are not justified by its running costsHowever, Genesis Analytics argues that Telkom’s fees are not justified by its running costs"
I fucking agree , those MOFO's grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!
And what basis do you have to agree?
Telkom's fees might not be justified by its running costs, but its capital growth to keep investors happy is a different thing. Telkom's share price would die otherwise, and I dont think that can be overlooked easily, you have to respect that they are a business, so there is some truth to what they say.
The only way they can keep the same proffit and lower ADSL cost is to cross subsides or retrech people. Getting more customers means having to light more fibre so that probably doesnt work out all that well for them (and they would lose money elsewhere if people just moved to ADSL)
187<>Ceasar~
22 Apr 2005, 00:24
OMFW - your such a debate queen. Chill the fuck out for once. Your intentionally trying to be all "educated" when actaully most of the time you ramble on incomprehensibly to the general public.
In your above statement you actually come across as the one trying to defend Telkom , when half the "knowledgable" nation realises they been riding our stupidity as paying customers for each and every client to-date. They have ripped us off and we were to blind to realise it. Its about time we took action and had a fair and reasonable service. We are not third world anymore karnaugh. Time to join your fellow South Africans and agree on the "raping" thats ben going on , and not support it.
|sAvAgE|
22 Apr 2005, 01:04
if you dont understand this bit:Telkom's share price would die otherwise, and I dont think that can be overlooked easily, you have to respect that they are a business, so there is some truth to what they say.
and all you can see is Karnaugh "contradicting" himself, then i suggest you "Chill the fuck out for once".
just coz somebody decided to air the "otherside of the story" for once, doesnt mean they've changed sides all of a sudden. it means people actually keep in mind both parties, and get the facts, before rattling off bullshit.
Yeah, but I think corruption has SOME role to play there (with the goverment and all).
Just ym 2c.
187<>Ceasar~
22 Apr 2005, 15:40
if you dont understand this bit:
and all you can see is Karnaugh "contradicting" himself, then i suggest you "Chill the fuck out for once".
just coz somebody decided to air the "otherside of the story" for once, doesnt mean they've changed sides all of a sudden. it means people actually keep in mind both parties, and get the facts, before rattling off bullshit.
Firstly I understand everything he meant there, doesnt mean I have to agree that because Telkom is a "bussiness" we have to stand back and let them "rape" us. So they might lose a few months of 1000% profit share, but believe you me there are going to b many many other avenues for profit making in the near future with the rate of technology increase thesedays. Lets take a prime example of de-regulation being the UK, the primary telecommunications company namely BT since the law was passed are still and will still continue to be the NO 1 company in the UK. They are like the Telskum of South Africa.
Now with that aside maby its time to look at what he is saying and realise thats why the country is going through these court cases at the moment . Do you really think that the "nation is after Telkoms profit share - (not the general public , maby some bussiness sectors) The general paying public want fair and reasonable prices in relation to the rest of the world. WE HAVE BEEN UNKNOWINGLY RAPED, BECAUSE WE WERE SO NAIVE(spelling oops*).
The point is , its time for cheaper bandwidth and reasonable speeds across the nation. Its definitely NOT time to ne worrying about telkoms PROFIT SHARE or bussiness. Thats just Insane.
Lets take a prime example of de-regulation being the UK, the primary telecommunications company namely BT since the law was passed are still and will still continue to be the NO 1 company in the UK.
No. BT is an enforced monopoly just like Telkom. There has been no deregulation of PSTN access provision in the UK
Firstly I understand everything he meant there, doesnt mean I have to agree that because Telkom is a "bussiness" we have to stand back and let them "rape" us.
You may feel free to *read* my arguments, which point that the G O V E R N M E N T is the reason you are being "raped" I have not said stand back and let it happen, I've said point the blame in the right places!.
The point is , its time for cheaper bandwidth and reasonable speeds across the nation. Its definitely NOT time to ne worrying about telkoms PROFIT SHARE or bussiness. Thats just Insane.
Maybe its just UT ping times for you, and the pence you pay for your ADSL line - I however have bigger things to worry about. If you could open your eyes (Reffering to your ability to read my posts, and my website) then you would see that I have not said that it isnt time for cheaper bandwidth, or reasonable speeds. I have not told you to worry about Telkoms "profit share" I've told you to stop being naive about only seeing a small slice of the pie - you cannot point blame at Telkom for behaving like a business - clearly you have no understanding of this concept, I'm sure Boogyman could assist you with some.
<A>BioGizzard
22 Apr 2005, 23:42
well i think the telkom monopoly should be kicked in the nuts so that the rest of the businesses can provide a service to us to in the form of competition. nobody likes to pay the large amount of money, for a service that takes u 8 weeks to solve one fault, with a total of two dsl technicians in my area and then, they still have the nerve to retrench their staff so they can keep their profit margin. obviously they are in it for the money and they don't give a shit who they rob for it either.
this whole saga is just some lame attempt to keep the dogs of war at bay while they screw over some more ppl to make more money, i don't think anything will come from it
lower bandwith prices might be nice, but opening the market for competitive company's
would be more usefull then arguing about the price of their pathetic service. The only thing that will accomplish is a larger amount of jobless ppl and that would make their service even worse, cause who's gonna be there to do the work in the end....
just my 2c
lower bandwith prices might be nice, but opening the market for competitive company's
would be more usefull then arguing about the price of their pathetic service. The only thing that will accomplish is a larger amount of jobless ppl and that would make their service even worse
The hammer meets the head of the nail. Great post.
]H[ellboy
24 Apr 2005, 09:35
The hammer meets the head of the nail. Great post.
We will not win if we only target Telkom, the goverment needs to change its view on telecoms, funny thing is allot of the old rules and legislation in regard to our telecoms insusty was decided and brought into effect by the old goverment, who where so fearful of transmission being done they clamped as much of it down as they could...
times are changing and the ICASA hearing was the very first time ever that Telkom had to face up with the public. The results might not go our way but we are going in the right direction for sure!
I am sorry, but I go deaf when 10 years later I have to hear about the 'previous government' or 'apartheid regime's' fault. 10 Years is plenty time to sort out the Telecoms.
Hopefully the 2010 soccer cup will be insentive enough to fix things up.
Strange thing is, when I last checked, the goverment's budget needs are never met, why not use the loaaaads of money they get from telkom share, and use it to actually do something better than to buy BMW's to unlicensed drivers :/
I agree with u but Money is the route 2 all evil but life is what you make off it!
Go away, this is a discussion about Telecoms.
Another prediction - the lost revenue the government will make from their share in Telkom, they will make up with their share in the SNO.
It is a win win for them no matter what they regulate or enforce.
Another prediction - the lost revenue the government will make from their share in Telkom, they will make up with their share in the SNO.
It is a win win for them no matter what they regulate or enforce.
Thats the point , the faster they share the Network the faster the country grows in all areas. The faster we end up being a educated well organised nation. It will take time , so each second we waste being limited by TELSKUM the longer we sit in the dark ages.
rant rant rant rant
telkom sucks
rant rant rant
raped by telkom
rant rant rant
soz - feeling left out in the bashing. Feel free to replace the "rants" with whatever you feel like.
My actual point: Let telkom charge whatever they want but then give the public the option of choosing something else. Having their new customers drop to 0% might actually force Telkom to be competetive. Pity that the SNO won't be able to be competitive for years since it'll be renting just about everything from telkom :(
Yeah i heard that the SNO will definitely be using the electricity cabling across the nation. Did you know that electrical cables hold plenty of copper, enough to run a whole complete seperate network to TELSKUM!!!!
Yes thats right folks, Telkom are very worried about profit loss since all their infrastructure is not entirely needed to supply Fast internet , or other similar services.
the SNO will not be using "electricity cabling"
They will be using Eskoms fibre backbone that they feed with their long haul power lines.
I also read that somewhere karn. Can't remember where though :).
I've read it in lots of places (none exactly in high regard), and you can take it from me that its bullshit ;)
Listen , my definition of "electricty cables" is very loose. Let me tell you that the SNO is going to be using Eskoms electrical backbone , if its also fibreoptics then so be it. If you thinks its bullshit and that im making it up, then fine thats your ignorance.
I have legit sources for my information. "My famliy here in Cape Town run electrical sub-contracting companies wich are currently working on this system. (Not electricians- pls dont confuse) The compant subcontracts to "Telskum" doing work from setting informal settlements with electricity to setting up Cell C'z network.
The Telskum network isnt the only one, there are other ways.
I have legit sources for my information too - namely - Eskom. As well as the research department at my university...
I dont see how that quote relates to anything, what does providing electricity to Cell C's network have to do with the price of eggs? They interconnect towers with long haul microwave.
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